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	<title>Comments on: The choice is easy</title>
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	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 05:53:46 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Wombat</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269292</link>
		<dc:creator>Wombat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2006 13:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269292</guid>
		<description>David,&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Fair enough re the Bibbi quote, but as you can see, it't misleading to suggest it is a moonbat lefty myth.  Beside,s the fact that Netanyahu denied it is by no means evidence  in itself.  The guy is hardly renowned for his honesty.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;If you want to get into discussing dissinformation, you could claim that every journalist who parroted the WMD/911/Al Qaeda connection line with regard to Iraq, was peddling right wing propaghanda.  Ye sit was sources, but it was far from vetted by rigorous investigation.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Similarly with the Iranian nuclear issue.  There are plenty of eight wing hacks saying that Iran is building nukes or enriching bomb grade materrial in spite of the evidence to the contrary.  Very rarely, so these articels actually source information from nuclear experts - only politicians.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Unfortunately, it's these enablers of myth that have positioned themselves a the mainstream.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David,</p>
<p>Fair enough re the Bibbi quote, but as you can see, it&#8217;t misleading to suggest it is a moonbat lefty myth.  Beside,s the fact that Netanyahu denied it is by no means evidence  in itself.  The guy is hardly renowned for his honesty.</p>
<p>If you want to get into discussing dissinformation, you could claim that every journalist who parroted the WMD/911/Al Qaeda connection line with regard to Iraq, was peddling right wing propaghanda.  Ye sit was sources, but it was far from vetted by rigorous investigation.</p>
<p>Similarly with the Iranian nuclear issue.  There are plenty of eight wing hacks saying that Iran is building nukes or enriching bomb grade materrial in spite of the evidence to the contrary.  Very rarely, so these articels actually source information from nuclear experts - only politicians.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, it&#8217;s these enablers of myth that have positioned themselves a the mainstream.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269264</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2006 05:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Antony:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I'm not calling Klein a liar, I'm calling her a practitioner of irresponsible journalism.  She doesn't source the quote, and Bibi denied he ever said such a thing.  So the onus is on her, and she fails it.  Just because you find the sentiment congenial doesn't mean you should believe it, a priori.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;This whole quotation business sort of reminds me of the Georgie Ann Geyer episode in which the American columnist parroted the story that Sharon once boasted that the Jews run Washington.  It turns out that "quote" was fabricated by the &lt;i&gt;Islamic Association of Palestine,&lt;/i&gt; (IAP) which disseminated it in a press release.  According to the IAP, Sharon's comments appeared in a news broadcast by Kol Yisrael, the Voice of Israel radio. Problem was, Kol Yisrael confirmed that no such broadcast had ever been made.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The "Jews run Washington" story was a scam conducted by an organization that has since been shut down by the US government for its ties to &lt;i&gt;jihadist&lt;/i&gt; terrorism. In December, 2004, a federal judge in the U.S. city of Chicago ruled that the IAP (along with the Holy Land Foundation) was liable for a $156 million dollar lawsuit for aiding and abetting the terror group Hamas in the death of a 17-year-old American citizen. Though IAP has already had its assets frozen by the U.S. executive branch of the government, this represents the first time a U.S. court officially linked IAP to Hamas.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;After the hoax was revealed, Geyer’s syndicate disseminated the following Editor’s Note which appeared on 14 June 2002 in the &lt;i&gt;Chicago Tribune&lt;/i&gt;: &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;b&gt;“Editor’s note: Georgie Anne Geyer’s May 10 [2002] column included a quote from Ariel Sharon, 'I control America.’ This quote was widely reported in the Palestinian press but cannot be confirmed in independent sources. Geyer and Universal Press Syndicate regret not having attributed the quote more specifically.”&lt;/b&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;More than a little journalistic egg on the face in that little episode.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Addamo:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The intelligence classification of the material is not surprising, nor is it incriminating towards Israel.  There are any number of plausible reasons for it that have nothing to do with Israeli complicity.  Source protection in an ongoing investigation is just one that comes to mind.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;But what ABC (US) America did report was a statement from a senior FBI official who unequivocally stated that there was no Israeli involvement in 9/11.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Antony:</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not calling Klein a liar, I&#8217;m calling her a practitioner of irresponsible journalism.  She doesn&#8217;t source the quote, and Bibi denied he ever said such a thing.  So the onus is on her, and she fails it.  Just because you find the sentiment congenial doesn&#8217;t mean you should believe it, a priori.</p>
<p>This whole quotation business sort of reminds me of the Georgie Ann Geyer episode in which the American columnist parroted the story that Sharon once boasted that the Jews run Washington.  It turns out that &#8220;quote&#8221; was fabricated by the <i>Islamic Association of Palestine,</i> (IAP) which disseminated it in a press release.  According to the IAP, Sharon&#8217;s comments appeared in a news broadcast by Kol Yisrael, the Voice of Israel radio. Problem was, Kol Yisrael confirmed that no such broadcast had ever been made.  </p>
<p>The &#8220;Jews run Washington&#8221; story was a scam conducted by an organization that has since been shut down by the US government for its ties to <i>jihadist</i> terrorism. In December, 2004, a federal judge in the U.S. city of Chicago ruled that the IAP (along with the Holy Land Foundation) was liable for a $156 million dollar lawsuit for aiding and abetting the terror group Hamas in the death of a 17-year-old American citizen. Though IAP has already had its assets frozen by the U.S. executive branch of the government, this represents the first time a U.S. court officially linked IAP to Hamas.</p>
<p>After the hoax was revealed, Geyer’s syndicate disseminated the following Editor’s Note which appeared on 14 June 2002 in the <i>Chicago Tribune</i>: </p>
<p><b>“Editor’s note: Georgie Anne Geyer’s May 10 [2002] column included a quote from Ariel Sharon, &#8216;I control America.’ This quote was widely reported in the Palestinian press but cannot be confirmed in independent sources. Geyer and Universal Press Syndicate regret not having attributed the quote more specifically.”</b></p>
<p>More than a little journalistic egg on the face in that little episode.</p>
<p>Addamo:</p>
<p>The intelligence classification of the material is not surprising, nor is it incriminating towards Israel.  There are any number of plausible reasons for it that have nothing to do with Israeli complicity.  Source protection in an ongoing investigation is just one that comes to mind.  </p>
<p>But what ABC (US) America did report was a statement from a senior FBI official who unequivocally stated that there was no Israeli involvement in 9/11.</p>
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		<title>By: Wombat</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269252</link>
		<dc:creator>Wombat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2006 00:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269252</guid>
		<description>So David,&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Do you have any proof that this is urban myth and been subsequently debunked, or are you relying loony right wing urban legend?&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;As for the 20/20 reporet, care to explain the Fox news sotry by Carl Cameron that quoted a US official as saying that information linking the events of 911 to Israeli spies had been classified?  Hard to see how 20/20 could come to any conclusions seeing as one could safely presume the they could not report on classified documents.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Of course, the story was later pulled by Fox.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So David,</p>
<p>Do you have any proof that this is urban myth and been subsequently debunked, or are you relying loony right wing urban legend?</p>
<p>As for the 20/20 reporet, care to explain the Fox news sotry by Carl Cameron that quoted a US official as saying that information linking the events of 911 to Israeli spies had been classified?  Hard to see how 20/20 could come to any conclusions seeing as one could safely presume the they could not report on classified documents.</p>
<p>Of course, the story was later pulled by Fox.</p>
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		<title>By: Antony Loewenstein</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269251</link>
		<dc:creator>Antony Loewenstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2006 00:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Guess Naomi Klein must be lying about Netanyahu then?&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;http://www.guardian.co.uk/russia/article/0,2763,1301504,00.html&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Hard to believe that Israel would be "pleased" with 9/11? That doesn't imply their involvement, merely their political  understanding of how to "use" the event.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Guess Naomi Klein must be lying about Netanyahu then?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/russia/article/0,2763,1301504,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.guardian.co.uk/russia/article/0,2763,1301504,00.html</a></p>
<p>Hard to believe that Israel would be &#8220;pleased&#8221; with 9/11? That doesn&#8217;t imply their involvement, merely their political  understanding of how to &#8220;use&#8221; the event.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269249</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2006 00:14:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269249</guid>
		<description>Nope Addamo: &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;You once again are dealing in lefty urban legend.  Netanyahu never said anything of the sort.  This is the sort of myth that is peddled by the same loony left/Arab outlets that claim Israel was responsible for 9/11.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;And as for the claim of direct Israeli involvement, the same ABC (USA) 20/20 TV report that has been selectively quoted by the myth peddlers states clearly that the Israelis swooped up in the widespread arrest of thousands of foreigners after 9/11 had no knowledge of the attacks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nope Addamo: </p>
<p>You once again are dealing in lefty urban legend.  Netanyahu never said anything of the sort.  This is the sort of myth that is peddled by the same loony left/Arab outlets that claim Israel was responsible for 9/11.  </p>
<p>And as for the claim of direct Israeli involvement, the same ABC (USA) 20/20 TV report that has been selectively quoted by the myth peddlers states clearly that the Israelis swooped up in the widespread arrest of thousands of foreigners after 9/11 had no knowledge of the attacks.</p>
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		<title>By: Wombat</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269247</link>
		<dc:creator>Wombat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2006 23:32:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269247</guid>
		<description>What Netanyahu apparentyl did say was "it's very good"  followed by, "it's not good, buit it will generate immediate sympathy for Israel"&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;It is revealing that in the face of disaster inflicted on Israel's greatest ally, Bibbi's first reponse was what was in it for Israel. How very galant and considerate of him.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What Netanyahu apparentyl did say was &#8220;it&#8217;s very good&#8221;  followed by, &#8220;it&#8217;s not good, buit it will generate immediate sympathy for Israel&#8221;</p>
<p>It is revealing that in the face of disaster inflicted on Israel&#8217;s greatest ally, Bibbi&#8217;s first reponse was what was in it for Israel. How very galant and considerate of him.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269244</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2006 20:06:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269244</guid>
		<description>Progressive falsehoods:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Sorry, Prog, but the "quotation" that you attribute to Bibi Netanyahu is a lefty urban legend, a falsehood.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;And I find it fascinating that you seem to be buying into the loony lefty conspiracy theories linking Israel and the 9/11 attacks.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;But then, I guess it stands to reason, doesn't it?  After all, the Jews:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;A) run the banks,&lt;br/&gt;B) run the media&lt;br/&gt;C) run the government&lt;br/&gt;D) kidnap Christian children and ritually slaughter them to use their blood for Passover matzah&lt;br/&gt;E) poisoned the wells, causing the Black Death of the 14th century&lt;br/&gt;F) killed Jesus</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Progressive falsehoods:</p>
<p>Sorry, Prog, but the &#8220;quotation&#8221; that you attribute to Bibi Netanyahu is a lefty urban legend, a falsehood.  </p>
<p>And I find it fascinating that you seem to be buying into the loony lefty conspiracy theories linking Israel and the 9/11 attacks.  </p>
<p>But then, I guess it stands to reason, doesn&#8217;t it?  After all, the Jews:</p>
<p>A) run the banks,<br />B) run the media<br />C) run the government<br />D) kidnap Christian children and ritually slaughter them to use their blood for Passover matzah<br />E) poisoned the wells, causing the Black Death of the 14th century<br />F) killed Jesus</p>
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		<title>By: Wombat</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269243</link>
		<dc:creator>Wombat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2006 16:29:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269243</guid>
		<description>David,&lt;br/&gt;I garee with you about Azzam Tamimi’s propensity to trip over this own tongue, though after reading Andy Bannister’s piece, I wonder about the integrity of your sources.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Andy Bannisters piece read like it had been passed through a very biased filter.  He warns against the threat of cultural imperialism, while failing to acknowledge that it has been alive and well for centuries in the West.  He dotes repeatedly on the blatantly biased conclusions of Jay Smith, from the  Park Christian Fellowship.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;For example, take these quotes, “Mr. Smith challenged both Dr. Winter and Dr. Tamimi to show how one could exegete the sword verses in a way that was "peaceful", a challenge they failed to rise to. “&lt;br/&gt;“Whilst those who had done any Islamic studies could easily see that Dr. Tamimi was attempting to give a glorious sheen to some decidedly tarnished aspects of Islamic history, the rest of the audience did not always follow.”&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;How blinkered does one to be to avoid the elephant in the room about the failure of Christian movement throughout history in this regard? &lt;br/&gt;Bannister clearly went to the event, already knowing what he was going to report.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David,<br />I garee with you about Azzam Tamimi’s propensity to trip over this own tongue, though after reading Andy Bannister’s piece, I wonder about the integrity of your sources.</p>
<p>Andy Bannisters piece read like it had been passed through a very biased filter.  He warns against the threat of cultural imperialism, while failing to acknowledge that it has been alive and well for centuries in the West.  He dotes repeatedly on the blatantly biased conclusions of Jay Smith, from the  Park Christian Fellowship.</p>
<p>For example, take these quotes, “Mr. Smith challenged both Dr. Winter and Dr. Tamimi to show how one could exegete the sword verses in a way that was &#8220;peaceful&#8221;, a challenge they failed to rise to. “<br />“Whilst those who had done any Islamic studies could easily see that Dr. Tamimi was attempting to give a glorious sheen to some decidedly tarnished aspects of Islamic history, the rest of the audience did not always follow.”</p>
<p>How blinkered does one to be to avoid the elephant in the room about the failure of Christian movement throughout history in this regard? <br />Bannister clearly went to the event, already knowing what he was going to report.</p>
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		<title>By: Progressive Atheist</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269236</link>
		<dc:creator>Progressive Atheist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2006 10:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269236</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Everyone in the Arab world applauded the attacks against the World Trade Center.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Not just the Arabs. Workers for an Israeli removal company in NY (actually a front) jumped for joy too. Remember? And when Netanyahu was asked what he thought about the attacks, he replied, "Splendid!"</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Everyone in the Arab world applauded the attacks against the World Trade Center.</i></p>
<p>Not just the Arabs. Workers for an Israeli removal company in NY (actually a front) jumped for joy too. Remember? And when Netanyahu was asked what he thought about the attacks, he replied, &#8220;Splendid!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: orang</title>
		<link>http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269223</link>
		<dc:creator>orang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2006 07:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://antonyloewenstein.com/blog/2006/01/31/the-choice-is-easy/#comment-269223</guid>
		<description>Ant, you should warn us before you link to Pipes. Some people have high blood pressure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ant, you should warn us before you link to Pipes. Some people have high blood pressure.</p>
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